Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate

occupymissoula
Administrator

Posts: 67

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 8, 2011 13:24:13 GMT -7

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Post by occupymissoula on Dec 8, 2011 13:24:13 GMT -7

BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
200 WEST BROADWAY ST.
MISSOULA, MT 59802-4292
PHONE: (406) 258-4877
FAX: (406) 721-4043

Occupy Missoula Participants:

Missoula County Commissioners and staff continue to monitor the presence of Occupy Missoula on the Courthouse lawn. Missoula County strongly supports the right of any group to peaceably assemble and articulate grievances. The County respects the resourcefulness of the Occupy Missoula group and is grateful for what has been a peaceful and relatively respectful relationship to date despite frustration experienced by each entity.

Missoula County has fielded dozens of calls and emails from County citizens complaining about the presence of Occupy Missoula on the Courthouse lawn. Missoula County staff has spent countless hours developing and maintaining relationships with numerous individuals associated with the Occupy Missoula movement. Staff has seen a significant increase in incidences of unsanitary conduct requiring even more staff time to mitigate the problem and causing increased exposure of County staff to pathogens. The nature and source of the unsanitary conduct, whether from Occupy Missoula or the adjacent population of homeless individuals, is immaterial. Regardless of who the culprits are, the situation is untenable and frankly, well above and beyond what the County should be asking of its staff on a frequency such as this.

Missoula County has been patient with Occupy Missoula, but the movement’s presence on the Courthouse lawn is creating more problems than the County has the staff or money to solve. Missoula County would like to request that Occupy Missoula relocate their camp or use the gazebo without tents during the day. Commissioners and staff are concerned that this request will cause Occupy Missoula to believe the County is trying to undermine their movement. That is not the case. The County must manage its grounds and staff in a way that is responsible to tax payers and residents. This movement appears to be long-term and focuses on issues that are beyond the ability of Missoula County to resolve. Missoula County must emphasize that the current situation inappropriately requires taxpayers to subsidize Occupy Missoula’s camp. Missoula County respectfully requests that Occupy Missoula re-shape the physical presence of its movement in order to address these issues.

Please advise Missoula County of Occupy Missoula’s intentions by Monday, December 12th, 2011. We look forward to hearing from you.

Respectfully,
Missoula Board of County Commissioners

Letter from County to Occupy Missoula: occupymissoula.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=1082' rel='attachment wp-att-1082

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Here is a list of emails that the County sent their "Press Release" to:

From: bcc bcc bcc@co.missoula.mt.us
Date: Thu, Dec 8, 2011 at 11:04 AM
Subject: Missoula County Commissioner's Letter
To: occupymissoula@gmail.com
Cc:
Peter Christian peterc@centric.net,
Brian Lee brianlee@cherrycreekradio.com,
GMerriam@ci.missoula.mt.us,
MCoyle@ci.missoula.mt.us,
John Murray john@clarkforkchronicle.com,
Andrew Czorny Aczorny@co.missoula.mt.us,
Anne Hughes ahughes@co.missoula.mt.us,
Dale Bickell dbickell@co.missoula.mt.us,
Joanna Cameron jcameron@co.missoula.mt.us,
Jennifer Thompson jthompson@co.missoula.mt.us,
Larry Farnes lfarnes@co.missoula.mt.us,
Laurie Hire lhire@co.missoula.mt.us,
Patty Rector prector@co.missoula.mt.us,
Rob McDonald robertmc@cskt.org,
Kaylene Nelson kaylenenelson@gapbroadcasting.com,
Pete Deneault petedeneault@gapbroadcasting.com,
Lesley Lotto lesleylotto@gmail.com,
markhebert42@gmail.com,
KUFM News mtpruca@gmail.com,
KBGA Director news@kbga.org,
news@keci.com,
Steve Fetveit sfetveit@keci.com,
info@kmso.com,
Breanna Roy breanna@kpax.com,
Dennis KPAX Dennis@kpax.com,
Irina Cates irina@kpax.com,
KPAX News Director news@kpax.com,
craig@kyssfm.com,
Jim McGowan Jim.mcgowan@lee.net,
Joel Baird jbaird@mcat.org,
Indy Calendar calendar@missoulanews.com,
Independent News Desk sbrowning@missoulanews.com,
Betsy Cohen bcohen@missoulian.com,
Chelsi Moy Chelsi.Moy@missoulian.com,
Gwen Florio gwen.florio@missoulian.com,
Jenna Cederberg jenna.cederberg@missoulian.com,
Kim Briggeman kbriggeman@missoulian.com,
Keila Szpaller keila.szpaller@missoulian.com,
Michael Moore mmoore@missoulian.com,
Missoulian News Desk newsdesk@missoulian.com,
Sherry Devlin sdevlin@missoulian.com,
Tristan Scott tscott@missoulian.com,
Montana Kaimin editor@montanakaimin.com,
Shelly shelly@montanaradio.com,
Montana Radio staff@montanaradio.com,
ASUM asum.vicepres@mso.umt.edu,
Nancy Wilson nancy.wilson@mso.umt.edu,
Kim Murray news@mtnbdc.com,
Sheila Callahan sc@mtnbdc.com,
Jonathan Weber jonathan@newwest.net,
Seeley Swan Pathfinder pathfinder@seeleylake.com,
KGVO Room kgvonewsroom@townsquaremedia.com,
Edward O'Brien edward.obrien@umontana.edu,
Sally Mauk sally.mauk@umontana.edu,
Susan Jamerson susan.jamerson@umontana.edu,
Bruce Burk lolopeaknews1@yahoo.com

Last Edit: Dec 8, 2011 13:45:48 GMT -7 by occupymissoula

brooklyn Guest	Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 8, 2011 19:11:57 GMT -7 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by brooklyn on Dec 8, 2011 19:11:57 GMT -7 Everyone is speechless. See you at the GA!

laurlea
Occupier

Posts: 11

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 8, 2011 22:37:00 GMT -7

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Post by laurlea on Dec 8, 2011 22:37:00 GMT -7

We can't assume that just because dozens have called to complain, that they are representative of the whole community. I personally know of one retired person who spend many, many years paying taxes, and would rather see them go to a cause that represents a change, rather than the pockets of the politicians bank accounts, and endless wars. Sincerely, Laura Jensen

hedgehog
Occupied

Posts: 63

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 9, 2011 9:44:13 GMT -7

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Post by hedgehog on Dec 9, 2011 9:44:13 GMT -7

a letter on dec 8, exactly 2 months since camping began. what a coincidence......the letter is not an angry letter. relocation....perhaps the commissioners have come up with some ideas on where and how they can help?
besides all that 'pathogen' nonsense, and we KNOW the alleged 'culprits' are not OM folks, (even the court folks know that), but because of the associated 'adjacent population of homeless individuals' and yes, they are often reckless and careless about trash and such, moving the camp always did sound like a good plan to me. i like the sacajawea park or the fairgrounds ideas. we could run our own door to door survey in those neighborhoods and get a vibe about re-encamping in one of those places after spring thaw. ;-0
i'm not at all happy that i cannot attend this sunday GA. working. i know for a fact that there are others in the GA who have also wanted to move the camp. thru this brief reply, i hope my concerns and ideas are somehow heard this sunday. ~~becca

katydid
Occupier

Posts: 18

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 9, 2011 14:01:48 GMT -7

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Post by katydid on Dec 9, 2011 14:01:48 GMT -7

Agreed. See you all at the GA!
While it does seem unfortunate that the dichotomous monster of our current political structure (left vs. right) (one vs. the other) has landed in the lap of the county Courthouse, is it not the job of the "court" to field citizen concern, mediate grievances, and act in the interests of the public good? I don't know that the public good should be limited to reducing the amount of taxpayer dollars that facilitate our democracy. If the "costs" that they refer to are really costs of their staff time talking to people about Occupy, listening to concerns of other citizens, and in general, dealing with an engaged public, then they stand to become the posterchild for the stifling of participation, albeit very diplomatic. As for the other incidences/costs, well, I do believe that the lawn maintenance, snow shoveling and assistance with cleanup on the part of Occupy Missoula, has likely had a net neutral effect on the actual costs the Occupy encampment has caused the County.
I might ask that the "complaintiffs" step forward and that the County can facilitate a mediated discussion between said concerned citizens and those of us interested in finding common ground with them-toward a more positive outcome.

Last Edit: Dec 9, 2011 14:03:18 GMT -7 by katydid

brooklyn Guest	Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 9, 2011 17:10:52 GMT -7 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by brooklyn on Dec 9, 2011 17:10:52 GMT -7 I like that idea perhaps we can "request" a public hearing on the subject. Before final decisions are made.

freegold
Occupier

Posts: 11

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 9, 2011 18:23:20 GMT -7

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Post by freegold on Dec 9, 2011 18:23:20 GMT -7

I do not buy the County's attempt to save face by asking Occupy Missoula to go away. This isn't the way grown ups face up to the real problems that are plaguing Missoula, Montana and the U.S.A. as we inexorably move into 2012. The County's position that "Missoula County has been patient with Occupy Missoula, but the movement’s presence on the Courthouse lawn is creating more problems than the County has the staff or money to solve. Missoula County would like to request that Occupy Missoula relocate their camp or use the gazebo without tents during the day. Commissioners and staff are concerned that this request will cause Occupy Missoula to believe the County is trying to undermine their movement. That is not the case. The County must manage its grounds and staff in a way that is responsible to tax payers and residents. This movement appears to be long-term and focuses on issues that are beyond the ability of Missoula County to resolve..." Occupy Missoula is not a "group" and the County Commission are not our parents. They are elected by us. They are responsible to and representative of us. They are part of us that have sworn to uphold, protect and defend the Constitution of Montana and the United States. It is not ok for them to state that they are something separate from us and that somehow we bring, "issues that are beyond the ability of Missoula County to resolve."
Exactly what are these mysterious issues that are that are beyond the ability of Missoula County to resolve?" I am going to start with what I think is the bottom line issue for all of us..

I for one need to step back and ask the hard questions. Why is it always "us" and "them." Are there any of the 1% currently involved in Missoula County or Montana politics? Or on the other hand are we all part and parcel of the 99%. The ones that share the common issues of not only not enough but the division between who has and who hasn't is pretty clear cut in Missoula and Montana. In Missoula the poverty rate is around 15% and overall statewide 18.4% (see www.ers.usda.gov/StateFacts/mt.htm). Yet, I believe that these statistics are low and misleading. So, where are the other 80 to 85% in Missoula? Are there super rich guiding the actions of our County? If you answer yes, then we truly have some problems. However, if you like me answer no, then our discussions need to include the County, the City, the police and the sheriff and all city and county departments (and any and all else who are invested and interested.) Because if we don't, then we will fail. It won't matter where "we" relocate, because there really is no us and them. The issues of pathogens, the issues of how these county representatives spend their limited resources is moot. Until these people realize that they are part of "us" they will never have the time or resources to deal with the "real" problems we all face.

Rick Gold
Missoula, MT

josh
Occupied

Posts: 77

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 10, 2011 9:00:18 GMT -7

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Post by josh on Dec 10, 2011 9:00:18 GMT -7

I don't think we necessarily need to worry about or fight too hard against relocation. It may well be time for some tactical innovations. Perhaps not having the camp to worry about/work on will light a fire under people for more direct actions. Here's the new blog post from Mike Konzcal (If you want to see the chart referred to, go to rortybomb.wordpress.com/2011/12/05/occupy-foreclosures-and-a-chart-of-changing-tactical-innovations-in-protest-movements/ ):

Occupy Foreclosures and a Chart of Changing Tactical Innovations in Protest Movements
Posted on December 5, 2011
Tomorrow Occupy begins a new front, with a national day of action that involves occupying foreclosed homes. Occupy Our Homes has created a list events at their site here.

Events are taking place in Brooklyn and Rochester New York; Los Angeles, Oakland, San Francisco, San Diego, San Jose, Petaluma and Contra Costa California; Lake Worth, Florida; Atlanta, Fayetteville, and DeKalb Georgia; Chicago, Illinois; Minneapolis, Minnesota; Denver, Colorado; Detroit and Southgate Michigan; St. Louis, Missouri; Portland, Oregon; and Seattle, Washington. If you aren’t familiar with what foreclosures are doing to neighborhoods across the country, this would be a good place to start. We’ll have more coverage on the matter during the rest of the week.

It looks like the previously successful tactic – occupying public spaces across the nation – is starting to collapse. Local cities have cracked down on occupations, and that battle looks to be over. New fronts are opening up though, from universities to foreclosed homes.

This is how it is supposed to go. Economist and friend of the blog Suresh Naidu sent me the following chart, and it’s a good one. The evolution of different tactics during the civil rights movement, 1955-1962, charted by frequency of occurrences:

This chart is taken from Tactical Innovation and the Pace of Insurgency by the sociologist Doug McAdam, who summarizes it as follows:

Given a political system vulnerable to challenge and strong internal organization the main challenge confronting insurgents is a preeminently tactical one. Lacking institutionalized power, challengers must devise protest techniques that offset their powerlessness. This is referred to as a process of tactical innovation. Such innovations, however, only temporarily afford challengers increased bargaining leverage. In chess-like fashion, movement opponents can be expected…to neutralize the new tactic, thereby reinstituting the power disparty…

As these figures show, peaks in movement activity tend to correspond to the introduction and spread of new protest techniques. The pattern is a consistent one. The pace of insurgency jumps sharply following the introduction of a new tactical form, remains high for a period of time, and then begins to decline until another tactical innovation sets the pattern in motion again….

the sheer number of actions is highest immediately following the introduction of a new protest form, as is the proportion of all actions attributed to the new technique. Thus, tactical innovation appears to trigger a period of heightened protest activity dominated by the recently introduced protest technique…tactical innovation seems to stimulate the renewed usage of all tactical forms. Thus, for example, the economic boycott, largely abandoned after the bus boycotts, was often revived in the wake of the sit-in demonstrations as a means of intensifying the pressure…

It’s a game between power and resistance. A strategy is innovated, to which institutionalized power reacts to counter. Power uses a variety of counter-innovations from co-option, discouragement to outright repression, which reduces the efficiency of that strategy. Because the tactic has used up its initial usefulness and because power has become adapt at countering it, new tactics have to be innovated.

Thus the advantages of the the Occupy movement – the creativity and energy of the participants, the permeability of the infrastructure in place – work towards this ever-evolving battle. I’d also argue that the lack of hierarchy, the regional and local characteristics of the movements and the lack of a platform help. If there’s a specific policy goal and it collapses, it’s harder to innovate a new front. Power is rigid and can control the framework of what is considered possible – the resistance has to be fluid and create a bigger vision than what is immediately doable.

Interesting note: future innovations raise the usage of all tactical forms – so if history is any guide, future innovations from Occupy can redouble efforts at previous ones, say public occupations.

Here’s to many more tactical innovations.
(c) Mike Konczal [reprinted without permission]

Last Edit: Dec 10, 2011 9:01:24 GMT -7 by josh

josh Occupied Posts: 77	Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 10, 2011 12:01:18 GMT -7 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by josh on Dec 10, 2011 12:01:18 GMT -7 Here's the link to the original journal article that Konczal references. It's a fairly short but enlightening read: www.nd.edu/~rmcveigh/change/McAdam.pdf

kim
Occupied

Posts: 82

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 10, 2011 19:41:44 GMT -7

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Post by kim on Dec 10, 2011 19:41:44 GMT -7

Jim proposed we use the forum before the GA on 12/11 to brainstorm and discuss the county's request to relocate. What are people's thoughts on this?
I like the idea. I feel like we need to really focus on what we can accomplish moving forward. Where do we want to put our energies, where it will be most effective? What does the camp mean, how can we best support the campers, and how can we best support the movement?
-KB

katydid Occupier Posts: 18	Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 10, 2011 21:40:41 GMT -7 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by katydid on Dec 10, 2011 21:40:41 GMT -7 Casey and Kate agree

sara Occupier Posts: 15	Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 10, 2011 23:19:14 GMT -7 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by sara on Dec 10, 2011 23:19:14 GMT -7 Sara also agrees.

kim
Occupied

Posts: 82

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 11, 2011 22:00:50 GMT -7

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Post by kim on Dec 11, 2011 22:00:50 GMT -7

"Occupy Missoula "passes the buck" concerning unsanitary conditions"
Link: www.kpax.com/news/occupy-missoula-passes-the-buck-concerning-unsanitary-conditions/
Let the reporter know what your think about this "journalism" based on her 15 or 20 minutes observing a GA by contacting Alex Schwier: Salex@kpax.com

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MISSOULA- Occupy Missoula members spoke out Sunday after being told to "clean up camp" by county officials.

County officials told the Occupy Missoula movement last Thursday to move off the courthouse lawn. In response, around 50 Occupy members met Sunday afternoon, deciding they will not move any time soon.

Missoula County said the Occupy Missoula movement causes problems the county doesn't have the "staff or money to solve."

The Occupy movement responded by saying the issues concerning the County have nothing to do with the movement at all. In fact, they believe they help in keeping the courthouse lawn clean.

"I know that when the Porta-potties were knocked over, not by Occupy Missoula, but by some drunk person, Occupy Missoula picked it up," said Occupy Missoula member Casey Louis. "Occupy Missoula also cleaned up leaves and raked snow and took away garbage and compost, so as far as addressing that? We have been respectful citizens in our expression."

Many Occupy members say it is the homeless individuals, not associated with the Occupy movement, who should be blamed for the unsanitary conditions.
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occupymissoula Administrator Posts: 67	Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 12, 2011 1:06:28 GMT -7 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by occupymissoula on Dec 12, 2011 1:06:28 GMT -7 Also, KPAX is soliciting comments on its facebook pages. I think we need to balance out all of the negativity:

laurlea
Occupier

Posts: 11

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate Dec 12, 2011 9:24:42 GMT -7

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Post by laurlea on Dec 12, 2011 9:24:42 GMT -7

I left a comment on KPAX's fb comments. Maybe folks here when they go to check on the encampment might carry out a bag of garbage? I took a bag on the bus with me and used my dumpster to empty it in. Thanks if you can, and it's ok if you can't.

OccupyMissoula

Missoula County "Requests Occupy Missoula Relocate

Post by occupymissoula on Dec 8, 2011 13:24:13 GMT -7

Post by brooklyn on Dec 8, 2011 19:11:57 GMT -7

Post by laurlea on Dec 8, 2011 22:37:00 GMT -7

Post by hedgehog on Dec 9, 2011 9:44:13 GMT -7

Post by katydid on Dec 9, 2011 14:01:48 GMT -7

Post by brooklyn on Dec 9, 2011 17:10:52 GMT -7

Post by freegold on Dec 9, 2011 18:23:20 GMT -7

Post by josh on Dec 10, 2011 9:00:18 GMT -7

Post by josh on Dec 10, 2011 12:01:18 GMT -7

Post by kim on Dec 10, 2011 19:41:44 GMT -7

Post by katydid on Dec 10, 2011 21:40:41 GMT -7

Post by sara on Dec 10, 2011 23:19:14 GMT -7

Post by kim on Dec 11, 2011 22:00:50 GMT -7

Post by occupymissoula on Dec 12, 2011 1:06:28 GMT -7

Post by laurlea on Dec 12, 2011 9:24:42 GMT -7

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